Messianic Jewish Hate Campaign Against Real Jews in Full Swing

Using the Ariel bombing as an excuse, Christian cults operating in Israel under the name Messianic Jews, particularly in Arad, have begun a campaign of hate against Jews.

Like Scientologists, the cults calling themselves Messianic Jews claim that they’re being persecuted. Numerous videos across YouTube with titles like “Now This is Why Everyone Hates Jews” document clashes that they generate with Jews. Meanwhile more “sympathetic” stories are being run on the Jerusalem Post which relies heavily on Christian dollars about how they’re persecuted. Not a word about the violent attacks, fraud and child abuse perpetrated by these cult members or their rabid hatred of Jews.

These cults calling themselves Messianic Jews operating in Israel are non-Jewish and actually violently hateful toward Jews. They sometimes try to disguise it with a Pro-Israel veneer but give them 5 minutes and they begin ranting about Pharisees and the Synagogue of Satan, Kabbalistic Satanism and really unleashing a vile torrent of filth. Aviad Cohen’s old videos before he had them taken down (formerly 50 Shekel) and a prominent cult member were typical of these.

The Messianic Jews are really Non-Jewish Christians with messed up belief systems ranging from carrying out present day sacrifices to believing that Jesus (or as they call Jesus, Yeshua) came on a UFO. They’re into defrauding people, bringing them into the cult and working them non-stop and siphoning away their life savings. Just like Scientology.

But these phony cults which call themselves Messianic Jewish synagogues and come with fake Rabbis don’t just take advantage of Jews, they take advantage of Christians. Rabbi Ari Crockett is a typical example. Messianic Jewish cults may call themselves Jewish but they’re mostly made up of Christians, which means they target Christians for cult membership. Christians who sympathize with them should remember that their sons and daughters could be next and that while that these fake Messianic Jews may talk a lot about Jesus, they’re no different than the Moonies or Harei Krishnas or any other cult.

They target both Jews and Christians for their cults. They use lies and deceit. They have lawyers to protect their cult leaders from their crimes. They use violence and terroristic threats. And their goal is to take control of people’s lives.

The most famous Messianic Jewish cult died horribly at Waco Texas when they murdered Federal agents to protect their child molesting leader, David Koresh. Like most messianic groups, they were mostly Christians with a handful of Jews. They were filled with hate for the outside world by their leader and willing to do anything.

It’s natural that Jews in Israel don’t want such people or such cults setting up shop. Just as virtually no country in the world allows them to set up their cults. So they’ve resorted to a Pro-Israel veneer running sites like IsraelToday.co.il that pretend to be Pro-Israel on the surface to shake down Christians and Jews for money. At Arad and with thugs like Eddie Beckford leading them, it’s easy to see their real face. Despite all the lies put out on the web by their messianic cult, the messianic cult in Arad, Eddie Beckford and his followers are the primary source of hate waging a ruthless campaign against the Jews of Arad.

In the town of Arad Messianic cult leaders like Eddie Beckford have waged a campaign of hate against Jews while using Messianic outlets to present themselves as innocent victims. Yet the above video which shows Eddie Beckford trying to run down a Jewish man doesn’t show an innocent victim. There are other videos that show violent assaults. Yet Beckford’s Arad cult has successfully blanketed YouTube with numerous videos filled with hate for Jews while portraying themselves as the victims based on a shouting match with some Orthodox Jews. What their videos don’t show is the violent assaults they’ve committed against Orthodox Jews.

Jews should stand with our fellow Jews of Arad against Eddie Beckford and his creepy cult and hateful intentions. Donate to Yad Leachim‘s programs and flag the Arad videos as hateful if you come across them.

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56 thoughts on “Messianic Jewish Hate Campaign Against Real Jews in Full Swing

  1. Adam J. Bernay says:

    This is the most ridiculous tripe every put on the web. First, you make a ridiculous accusation of “violent attacks, fraud and child abuse perpetrated by” Messianics and fail to substantiate them; then you make a totally specious connection of the Branch Davidians with Messianic Judaism when there is in fact no connection (and you don’t even try to substantiate that). You show clips of video which show us no context and no substantiation that they are what you claim, videos that look pretty staged, BTW.

    Substantiate your claims, if you can, or repent of your lashon hara.

  2. Adam J. Bernay says:

    Having seen a HaEretz report with some actual substantiation, I want to apologize, because it looks like yes, there is some violence on the part of Messianics in Arad. But you CONVENIENTLY do not point out that they are not the only ones engaging in it, nor did they instigate it. It is the Haredi who have been attacking the Messianics; when the Messianics fight back, suddenly they are a violent cult. They are not right to act as they do (though I have no problem with self-defense), but they are not as you depict. Your analysis is slanted and ignores the fact that they were attacked.

    If the Haredi wish to demonstrate peacefully, they can do so. They have assaulted the Messianics, and that is wrong. The retaliation beyond simple self-defense on the part of the Messianics is also wrong, albeit understandable. It should stop, but so should the attacks by the Haredi, as should the false accusations. Messianics do not engage in forced conversions. Messianics do not coerce. It is central to Messianic theology that choices must be individual and not forced.

  3. samuraimohel says:

    Branch Davidians were Messianics, http://dan.tobias.name/controversies/davidian/

    it simply isn’t talked about very much because the well funded messianic movement finds that sort of thing embarrassing

    She is a member of the Davidian faction which presently controls the property, and is probably the author of most of the material up on the walls. The door to the building she was in was labeled “Messianic Jews,” and she regards the Davidians (a splinter group from the Seventh Day Adventists, which observe the Jewish sabbath) as the true spiritual descendants of the Jewish people.

    The Haredim have protested against Messianic cults. They’ve shouted slogans and held up signs. Sometimes they’ve shoved and blocked the way. In response people like Beckford have carried out violent physical assaults. The messianic cult in Arad began the violence, and just like at Waco, they’re eager to play the victims.

    Messianic cults target minors. They practice deceit at every turn. They conceal their real affiliation and once people join their cult, their self-esteem is often undermined and their resources drained and their lives taken over.

    So save the BS for someone else

  4. Adam J. Bernay says:

    In regards the Branch Davidians, I’ve not seen anything ever that shows what you claim. There may be some people claiming it, but the article shows clearly they splintered from the Seventh Day Adventists, which has no connection whatsoever with the Messianic community. Just because they called themselves Messianic Jews didn’t make them a part of our community. Their doctrines are totally alien to the Messianic faith.

    And all the reports — other than those from the Haredim — indicate the Haredim began the violence. And what is their “real affiliation” and where is your substantiation for your other claims?

  5. samuraimohel says:

    I just put up a link demonstrating that members of the Branch Davidians describe themselves as Messianic Jews.

    David Koresh started out in the Southern Baptist Church, which funds many of the messianic jewish groups out there. He joined a a splinter Adventist Church that was blatantly Messianic influenced

    As you well know, there’s a direct bridge between Seventh Day Adventists and Messianics and even the mainstream Adventist Church conducts Messianic Jewish services and runs at least one Messianic Adventist synagogue in Israel. They even have a fellowship.

    http://adventistmessianicfellowship.com/

    The real affiliation of the Messianic Arad Church is a messianic Christian cult which claims to be Messianic Jews. Even though Eddie Beckford is a black Catholic from Harlem.

  6. Adam J. Bernay says:

    The Branch Davidians call themselves “Messianic.” Well, there are sects of mainstream Judaism that use that term too. The Davidians are Messianic in the sense that they believe in a Messiah, but they have personified this in modern times to physical people currently living. This is far less like the Messianic Jews in Arad and more like… oh, say, the Lubavitcher Chassidim who think their Rebbe Schneerson was/is the Messiah. You say, “As you well know, there’s a direct bridge between Seventh Day Adventists and Messianics,” well, no, I don’t know that. Simply because the SDAs have glommed onto the Messianic movement and started one or two congregations doesn’t make them part of the Messianic community.

    You keep labeling Messianics as a “Christian cult.” Funny, Christianity doesn’t feel the same way, especially when they find out we stress Torah Observance.

  7. samuraimohel says:

    There’s no branch of Judaism that calls itself Messianic. There are a wide variety of cults that call themselves Messianic Jews, their commonality is belief in the Christian savior Jesus Christ and attempts at integrating some fragments of Judaism

    And I couldn’t care less whether you think Adventist Messianics are a legitimate Messianic movement or not. The one other constant in the Messianic movement is the constant infighting over who is a legitimate part of it or not. Since you’re all Christian cults, I couldn’t care less.

    The Branch Davidians like some Adventists self identify as Messianics. Those are facts.

  8. Leonard De marco says:

    Messianics do terrible harm to christianity too. They pretend to be jewish and infiltrate churches to destory them.

  9. Mango Sidell says:

    You know they lie to the Jews and to the Churches. I found on one of their sites how they will refuse to say trinity and gospel and Jesus because it scares people off! Can you imagine they lie and cover up what they really believe .
    My husband saw many people taken in by them . It is all about getting membership for money. Certainly the more members the more money these people make for themselves.
    But as a Methodist, I find them just a cult.

  10. Adam J. Bernay says:

    Responding to Samurai Mohel: There’s no branch of mainstream Judaism that calls itself messianic? In their official name, no. But most of Judaism is messianic. It is a messianic faith! Yes, many branches have decided — counter to all Scriptural evidence — that Israel is its own Messiah, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t messianic. And there is a large (and growing) messianic movement within the Lubavitcher Chassidim that say Schneerson is Messiah. Or do you worm out of your comment by claiming that any Jews who believe in any personified messiah are no longer Jewish? You know, it’s pretty funny for a guy who calls himself by the name of a pagan religious cult (the samurais were a militaro-religious cult) to be slamming other Jews with different beliefs as “cult members.”

    To Leonardo & Margo: I don’t know who you’re talking about, but you’ve encountered very poor examples of Messianics. The vast majority of the Messianic community is nothing like that.

  11. samuraimohel says:

    Congrats Adam, you’ve moved from subtle to outrightly blatant dishonesty. As before Messianic Judaism refers to a variety of Christian cults, some backed by Baptist churches, who believe in Jesus.

    Actual Jews have always believed that God sends Messiahs. As he intervenes in many ways to save us, from you. But they worship God who sends them. Not the men themselves. That is the difference between our two religions. Ours believes in God. Yours believes in a man.

    The rest of your pathetic attempts at an argument aren’t even worth answering.

  12. Haza says:

    Wow….this website is as legit as a $6 bill. Your claims are unfounded and typical of anti-missionary paranoid inflammatory nonsense. You, my friend, are not a Jew but a practioner of lashon hara and have your portion with the wicked in the place of the damned.

  13. Leah says:

    Dude you have a severe case of paranoid delusion with a healthy dose of just plain “liar” tossed into the mix. I am a Jew, born to a Jewish mother (and father), raised in an Orthodox home by my Rabbi grandfather and I made the choice to accept Yeshua as Messiah. I’ve met soooooo many Jewish believers that I really couldn’t count them if I tried. None of the Messianic “Jews” I met were non-Jews – those who were born Jewish are always going to be Jewish. There are Messianic non-Jews, Christians who choose to adopt a Jewish lifestyle – but I’ve yet to meet one who introduces themselves as “genetic” Jews. As for the Branch Davidians, what a stupid thing to toss into your otherwise insane article – it’s so pathetic – Koresh’s group (Branch Davidians) are off-shoots of 7th Day Adventists and none of them claim to be Jews.

    What a crock. Want to learn about truth and life – with a healthy dose of common sense? Go read (redacted site of an idol worshiping heroin addicted fraud claiming to be Jewish)

  14. samuraimohel says:

    Haza, nice that you learned about Lashon Hara. Now try and skip back to the commandment about not having any other Gods.

  15. samuraimohel says:

    “Leah”, you guys need a new routine. Every single messy out there does the same “I’ was an Orthodox Jew and my grandfather was an Orthodox Jew routine.” I remember Rabbi Ari Crockett claimed his grandfather was the Kohen Gadol of New York City. Man, I didn’t even know New York City had its own Kohen Gadol.

    Very few of you are actual Jews ethnically. None of you are Jews by religion. Want a healthy dose of common sense? Whether you’re Jewish or not, stop worshiping a man and start worshiping God.

  16. ddd says:

    IR A IDIOT THOSE ARE DIFERRENT MESSIANICS THOSE ARE MESSIANIC SHITES

  17. Keliata says:

    If can jump in here with a response to Adam–Of the established branches of Judaism–Orthodox, Conservative, Reform, Reconstructionist not one accepts Jesus as the messiah.

    We believe in a messianic era and that a messiah will usher it in–a Jewish man, entirely mortal, who observes every mitzvot, unlike jesus who violated several commandments and the had the audicity to claim he was god. G-d is not a man.

    Lastly, as for the messianic non-jews/christians interested in the Jewish lifestyle and worship…these are probably people who would be thrilled to learn about the Noachide Laws and the truth about G-d, who is noncorporeal.

  18. Rabbi Gamaliel (Christian Preacher, Fake Jew) says:

    Vernon Howell’s Branch Davidians were a renegade off shoot of the Seventh Day Adventist cult and they are both cults. The Messianic Jews or Jews for Jesus have nothing to do with them. Leah is right I also know so many Jews who are Messianics and have retained their Judaic roots. Until the Romans and Greeks took over Christianity and it became Catholic and Orthodox, and before Constantine legalized Christianity in the 4th Century, most of the early Christians were Jews themselves.
    This bashing of Messianic Jews makes me think whether you bashers are being anti-Semitic or antichrist? I don’t understand it. Christians have done so much to help Israel did you forget the help of Christians like Lord Balfour, Oscar Schindler, CUFI, Miep Gies, the Poles who hid the escapees from Sobibor and President Lyndon B. Johnson?
    Only the Reform sect believes in the Messianic Age. This belief is in error. The Tanach and Nevi’im support that a real physical Messiah will come as King and Elijah will procede Him. Also, the Jewish belief on Jesus of Nazareth varies from sect to sect and Jew to Jew, the Messianics believe Jesus is the Messiah, the Karaites believe Jesus a Prophet, the most rabid, hateful Jews believe Christ never existed and most others believe something else like Jesus was a great teacher or rabbi only, etc.
    I just don’t understand the hatred. The Gentiles who persecuted the Jews, the Romans, Russians, Germans, Hitler, Nicholas Chadeev, the Spanish Inquisition, Torquemada, Phillip II, the pogromites, George Lincoln Rockwell, Frank Collin and Fritz Kuhn are all dead or forgotten in this new liberal age of understandingl Just let it go alright if Jews become filled with hate to whoever are we any better than the those who hate US?

  19. Rabbi Gamaliel the Elder (Christian Preacher, Fake Jew) says:

    One more thing, if you argue that the Messianics are a cult they will just throw the Khabballah and the Talmud as cultic right back in your face!

  20. Its me! says:

    7th day adventists are no cult but a well respected religion that the rest of mainline Xianity butchered and murdered throughout history.
    They also went to concentration camps for being Sabbath keepers.
    You messy antics reek of lies and rotten cheese.

  21. samuraimohel says:

    I’ve already established the linkage between the Branch Davidians as a Messianic cult.

    There is no such thing as Messianic Jews. Only a variety of Messianic cults, most of them composed of non-Jews, who hate each other. The venom directed by Jews for Jesus (a Baptist backed corporate cult) at looser Messianic cults and right back alone is legendary.

    Jews do not become Messianic. Messianics are usually Christians, sometimes with Jewish roots somewhere, who drift out of established churches into Messianic cults. They work hard on paper to try and convert actual Jews but rarely succeed.

    Jews do not believe in your dead mangod. And never will. Even early on the majority of Jesus’ followers were not Jews.

    don’t understand it. Christians have done so much to help Israel did you forget the help of Christians like Lord Balfour, Oscar Schindler, CUFI, Miep Gies, the Poles who hid the escapees from Sobibor and President Lyndon B. Johnson?

    Are you really this stupid? Schindler was helping Jews escape the mass murder being perpetrated against them by millions of Christians. Christians have spent 2000 years killing Jews in the name of your perverted pagan heresy. And today you still keep on trying to wipe us out, spiritually if not physically. Yeah I can’t imagine why we aren’t bigger fans of yours.

    Just let it go alright if Jews become filled with hate to whoever are we any better than the those who hate US?

    We’re not filled with hate. We just know the truth and your lies won’t change that.

  22. Chaim says:

    As if this person who appropriates the name of a tzadek like Rabban Gamliel is a real Jew. What a farce.
    These messianic protestants are as phony as anything can be. Their entire focus is to preach to Jews . Most of their churches are filled with goyim prancing around doing lewd mixed dancing and so called “davidic” dances that look like the dance of the 7 veils.
    Its awful.

  23. RavYossef (Christian Preacher, Fake Jew) says:

    What exactly is a real jew? While we can argue descendancy from a Jewish mother and grandmother, that no longer seems to be a sufficient halacha since the OrthoNazis have decided that no Jew who accepts Y’shua as moshiach can remain a Jew…. its nice to know they have finally found someone to spew their hate towards besides the reform movement. But who does haShem claim is a Jew? A son of Avraham who keeps Mitzvoth would seem to be a good description… what then is Mitzvah haShem… but to love justice, to eschew mercy, and to walk humbly with your creator. Perhaps is was in the spirit of this true halacha from on high that the Sanhedrin of 33 CE turned over that nice Yid from Nazareth, Y’shua benYossef to be brutily murdered by the Roman Pagans… and perhaps that is why an innocent widow and her two adopted sons, all sabra by buirth and jews by definition are houded and harrassed on a daily basis by the haters of jews, the Gur Hassidim who worship their rabbis halacha above Torah Moshe and Halacha haShem. If a true jew is one who keeps the commandments of the Most High then these Gur Hassidim who persecute widows and orphans for sport are more like Haman than Y’hudah, who at least cared enough for his brother yossef to intervene and preserve his life.
    How long must we as Jews (ALL JEWS NOT JUST MESSIANICS) put up with the Tyranny of the Orthodox, with their halacha of hate, and their oral Torah of shame. It is time to rise up and reclaim the faith of Avraham for his children and to embrace hashems provision of his own son as the perfect Chatta’ah for A’von.

    Rav Yossef (Christian Preacher, Fake Jew)

  24. samuraimohel says:

    I’m sorry Hank McCoy, but calling yourself Rav Yosef and trying to use Jewish and Yiddish words does not make you Jewish.

    And a graduate of Faith Bible College calling Jews, Nazis while pretending to be Jewish is both disgusting and pathetic, and typical of your fraudulent and hate filled “Messianic movement”

    I could correct your many errors, both biblical and spelling, but it’s pointless. You’re a liar and you know you’re a liar. Your hate for Jews is masked by a futile attempt to masquerade as a Jew only in order to spread more hate.

    Who is a Jew? A Jew does not worship idols. A Jew does not worship men. Now beat it Hank.

    Kiss my ass and stop misrepresenting Tehilim.

    Father Connor McBean

  25. samuraimohel says:

    I really don’t care what your “real name” or how many names you use. Exposing con artists like you isn’t my full time job. On the other hand you obviously want attention so your rants in favor of your undies wearing mangod named Pedro or Jesus can go in the recycle bin.

  26. […] Church. They don’t come knocking on my door like other pointless suit-festooned fuckers or pray for me to go to hell, so we’re on pretty good […]

  27. samuraimohel says:

    You can’t “convert” from Lutheranism to Messianic, that’s a lateral move within Christianity from one pagan belief to another.

    We know what G-d thinks of us and we know what your “master race” thinks of us, Robert. And if you use the name of G-d in vain on this blog again you will be deleted.

  28. NorthStar says:

    Sam Moron,you are so filled with hate,you are Very Very Confused.You need professional help in the WORST way.You should try and RESEARCH before you try to spread your FOOLISH HATE. It is because of people like you there IS SO MUCH HATE. Jesus Christ never said he was GOD…..but that he IS the SON of GOD…I will pray for your conversion to THE ONLY TRUE GOD. In the mean time .Check the facts and LEARN. You can be forgiven for your hate filled lies just Give your life to Jesus and LIVE in the LIGHT instead of your VERY DARK HATE FILLED LONESOME WORLD. Cmon you can do it…..God bless the Holy name of JESUS CHRIST…….JUST THINK ABOUT TRUTH FOR ONCE…

  29. samuraimohel says:

    In my experience it’s the people who SHRIEK IN ALL CAPS who are the ones filled with Hate, NorthStar.

    And shrieking that I’m the one filled with HATE, when you begin your rant by calling me “Sam Moron” just makes it obvious that you’re the one confused here, because you’re filled with hate.

    Feel free not to pray to anything, as you’re praying to a dead man who hears you not because he’s dead. And I have less than zero interest in converting to worship your DEAD MAN RELIGION. Sorry but I prefer the living G-d who created heaven and earth, over a dead Jewish man that lunatic pagans like you decided to worship.

  30. Guy says:

    Messianic protestants don’t belong in Israel . Why they are going there Sam?
    I don’t get it.
    I am a Catholic from France. I had occasion to go see Israel and every place I was seeing these protestants people who are calling themself now messianic Jews.
    They are not even looking like Jewish people. They are just like the I think you call them born again Christian in America.
    Pardon my English.
    But yes, why do they try to steal Israel from real Jewish people ?

  31. samuraimohel says:

    Because they have no roots of their own, so they try to steal Jewish ones. Sad people, but rather nasty.

  32. Brandon says:

    Wow, there seems to be allot of anger here which is something i am sure G-d is not happy about ….. Samurai i truly believe you are entitled to your opinion & all Messianic’s are entitled to there view to. But something we should all remember is what ever our faith we are inherently brothers & sister’s put on this Earth by G-d. G-d is all powerful & is in control, if it were not his will no Jew would become Messianic no matter what they did & if it is his will all Jews would come back to Judaism & the Messianic movement would be no more.

    We all need to have more faith in G-d & stop trying to control an uncontrollable situation, G-d is doing something in this age & we need to be aware, there are enough haters in this world which goes against what Ad-nai wants. We don’t need to fight his battle’s.

    Many blessings to you Samurai & Everyone, let’s get some love for each other back.

  33. samuraimohel says:

    Being entitled to an opinion doesn’t make it right or wrong. It’s a completely meaningless thing to say.

    Nor does G-d make people become Messianic Christians, unless you also argue that he makes people become Buddhists and Muslims and Atheists. And if you go down that road, pretty soon your theology becomes gibberish.

    Free will means we get the chance to choose G-d or reject him. Messianic Christians reject G-d in favor of an idol. That is not something they can blame G-d for, that is their own faulty choice.

  34. David says:

    That is really disheartening news. And I happen to be messianic. That is where G-d has placed me. I was born and raised as a Christian. It is only through a slew of very strange and unexplainable events that I am where I am today.

    I personally despise (with great passion), the act of converting Jews to Christiantiy. Each day Christian evangelists target Jewish people. At Messianic shul I would cringe at when someone shared with enthusiasm how many Jews became “saved”.

    I also despise the idolatry that goes on within the movement because of its inherited Christian beliefs. Many times I cannot participate in worship services because of my personal belief that no one should replace G-d. For one it’s divisive, secondly it’s just not biblical. I would leave the service, but I sit patiently out of respect. It would be offensive to leave, however I do not participate when they sing “Jesus” songs.

    I also despise the teaching of purpose of this world and creation that comes with Christianity. They say, the whole purpose is to meet Jesus and be saved. Then,one is promised a place in heaven. This world is nothing more than a test. You and I both know this is not the case. This world was created with a purpose, and that purpose is to be a dwelling for G-d. And that purpose will be seen through, and is a big part of my agenda.

    Recently I’ve become separated from my wife (we finally fixed things B”H) and had to stay at my Grandparents house (who raised me as their own, and as a Christian). They insist I attend church with them, and so I do so out of respect and honor for my grandparents. I love them and wish to honor them.

    Let me tell you one thing I do know. Messianic Judaism most certainly began as a ruse. It was intended to be and still is nothing more than a Christian attempt to play dress-up and evangelize Jewish people. Christianity and it’s newer Messianic counterpart are a threat to the Jewish people. G-d forbid the Jews were assimilated. I don’t even need to explain how that is ultimately bad. But one wonderful thing is happening. Christians are learning about Torah, and they are HUNGRY for it. I have witnessed this first hand!

    But if there is one thing I’ve learned from G-d and the Torah, it’s that if you want to chop down a tree, you use a hatchet. Why? Because the hatchet is made of the same material. Look at Moshe and Egypt. Look at the hearts of men. All of these things require change from the inside-out.

    I know I may be a “Messianic Jew”, but I know that even though you can’t see it, somewhere in all these situations and labels that I wear, is the neshama of true yidden, and a star of David in my heart.

    This is why I am placed where I am placed. It is my calling to be here. To be the hatchet which cuts down the tree. This movement needs to be shaped, needs to be changed, needs to have it’s focus changed on bringing Christians to Torah, and not Jews to Christ. Why? To learn why we are here . To learn where we are truly going. Jewish people NEED to be involved to help steer this movement in the right direction, because it’s headed on a crash course with nothing good. Even more we need the Messianics that decided to leave and undergo orthodox conversion. Most Jews will never attempt a stunt like getting involved with J4J or Messianic Judaism, but the Messianic already knows Christianity inside and out. And being Christian in background, they are very evangelical and charismatic. Imagine the entire Messianic movement, loosing all of her false notions and deciding to turn her attention to Christians?

    Food for thought… -Dave

  35. Sammy Finkelman says:

    I don’t think it is accurate at all to call the Branch Davidians a Messianic Jewish cult, even ifg you might see some similiarty in their beliefs. They were a type of Christian that trieed to observe a few more Jewish commandments, or some version of them, like having Saturday as the day of rest and observing some kind of Passover, but there’s actually a whole bunch of people like that, and nobody would think of thhem as pretending to be Jewish. David Koresh adopted the name he did because he thought that by so doing he woukld some Biblical prophecies apply to himself (anything about David or Cyrus) and he was obsessed with decoding mostly Christian alleged prophecies. The group he was in also believed inb living prophets. He also became the only man in his group allowed to have sexual intercourse.

    I see you hahve accepted a lot of lies, although that is ot really your fault. Thhere was no cvhild abuse. That was part of teh welter of falser charges. They did not sytart the firefight on February 28, 1993. That was started by the BATF who went in without warning and they would haave murdered Koresh that day if they hadn’t overlooked the fact that cutting telephone wires would not eliminate cell phone connections. Three of the four BATf agents killed that day were probably murdered by J William Bufford, head of the BATF in Little zrock, and friend of Bill Clinton, aand later to cover that all up Bill Clinton arranged for the murder of the Branch Davidians at Waco.

    A lot of what you think you know may not be true, but you don;t have to add to the misinformation.

    I could give you a very long file about this whole thing with references.

  36. samuraimohel says:

    Branch Davidians were Messianics, http://dan.tobias.name/controversies/davidian/

    Messianic movements are not Jewish in the first place, they just borrow Jewish terminology, and recruit a few Jews into their ranks

    it simply isn’t talked about very much because the well funded messianic movement finds that sort of thing embarrassing

    “She is a member of the Davidian faction which presently controls the property, and is probably the author of most of the material up on the walls. The door to the building she was in was labeled “Messianic Jews,” and she regards the Davidians (a splinter group from the Seventh Day Adventists, which observe the Jewish sabbath) as the true spiritual descendants of the Jewish people.”

    David Koresh started out in the Southern Baptist Church, which funds many of the messianic jewish groups out there. He joined a a splinter Adventist Church that was blatantly Messianic influenced

    The child abuse is a fact. Koresh took underage brides to himself.

  37. Tabatha says:

    Messianics are Christians. They worship Jesus as Christ – they are Christians.

    The proof – as if any is needed – is t hat up until the 1960s there WERE NO “messianic jews”.
    They called themselves ‘Hebrew Christians’ instead. Still not accurate, but at least not as deceptive.

    The entire Messianic movement was founded by the southern Baptists who are fixated on converting Jews to Christianity.

    Let’s be really clear:

    A Jew who becomes a Christian = a CHRISTIAN, and an Apostate Jew

    Jewish religious law defines ‘jew’.

    Christianity doesn’t get to REdefine it.

    Southern Baptists don’t get to REdefine it.

    Messianics don’t get to REdefine it.

    If anyone would like to see how Messianics are trying to lure naive young British Jews into their Christian movement, then read THE MISSIONARY POSITION:

    http://www.ajewwithaview.com/?page_id=3

    Lies that Messianics tell – and how to counter them:
    http://www.ajewwithaview.com/?page_id=5

    Facts about Messianics – and how there are now ‘messianic muslims’ (Christians):
    http://www.ajewwithaview.com/?page_id=1650

    The truth about ‘jews4jesus’ – the group founded by an ORDAINED BAPTIST MINISTER:
    http://www.ajewwithaview.com/?p=1983

    SAMURAI:

    Hope you don’t mind my putting these links on your site?
    I’m just hopeful that some of the info I’ve amassed about Messianics might be helpful – I’m going to add a link to your site on my blog too 🙂

  38. samuraimohel says:

    Sure go ahead, it’ll give people something to read

  39. rivke channa says:

    Asn
    I started a journey back to my roots (adopted out of the tradition &raised athiest) I kept running into these fervent, agressively religious people who claimed they were Jewish, but worshipped “Yeshua.” OK, yeah, J was Joshua, and that’s a close translation, at at least not Greek.

    I read up on them, and the older “hebrew christian” movement they sprang from.
    I read up on other false messiah movements (shabbatai tzevi, anyone?)

    The most educational book was Carol Harris-Shapiro’s ethnology,” Messianic Jews.”

    I’m more of the camp that says messianics are not Jews, and I fully beleive that as regards to the gentiles in the movement, but what of the apostate Jews?

    we have outreach to reclaim them, and my Chabad rabbi friend says once a Jew,always a Jew.
    I would like to beleive they would return to the fold, or go fully into the Xtian world, rather than straddle two worlds.
    If they had no outreach,I ‘d not care what they beleived. But if they are coming up to me and prostitu….er…prostelytizing, it becomes my isssue.

    No right of return, as long as you are xtian.

    I am insistent that if one belives in J, one is Xtian. I beleive that is the basis of Xtianity, belief in the singular divinity of this one person.

    to the messianic gentiles, why not follow Noahide laws and accept what you were born as?
    the the born Jews, do you not beleive strongly enough to fully cross the line?

  40. michael says:

    Samurai,

    Keep it going!!! As a former Christian -Messy, It never ceases to amaze me how even the most obscure site related to Judaism seems to attract the J-Crew in droves. What is this perverse desire to be actively prosti–er preaching their load of goods to Jews at every opportunity.

    Really,your opinions aren’t being solicited and they aren’t appreciated. Please, leave Jews alone to worship Hashem and to be the people they were meant to be.

    I would like to observe that many involved in this movement do really have a heartfelt desire to love who they think is G-d. It is just that whole three-part god and worshiping a man-god that seems to get in the way. As may have already pointed out in this thread, Gentiles who have a heart to truly serve the G-d opf Israel, take up the Noahide laws. Don’t be idolaters. Abstain from torn flesh. Establish courts of righteous Justice. Or if you are really committed..take the plunge…convert!!

    Christians, please go and debate amongst yourselves exactly what time time of the day Yoshke was crucified, or exactly what Daniel 9 is talking about or any other number of the ridiculous things that seem to take up hours and days of otherwise well spent time. Coming onto a Jewish blog, a Jewish website, butting into an overheard conversation between Jews, in order to preach your “man-god” garbage…well it ain’t attracting any takers.

    Back to the greater point, and forgetting any other points of contention, did Yoshke fulfill the “first time” any of the things that the Messiah is meant to fulfill according to the Torah and the Prophets…..case closed!!!!!

  41. wildoliveleaf says:

    If by “Yoshke” you mean Yeshua Ha’Mashiach, it says it right in the biographies when He was put to death, about what we would call 9 o’clock in the morning.

    “Don’t be idolaters.” Amen!

    “Abstain from torn flesh.” Sure, if you understand that torn and cut flesh are two different things, you can read about it in ADONAI’s Holy Word.

    “Establish courts of righteous justice.” Amen!

    “If you are really committed…take the plunge…convert!!” Already have. Yeshua The Jewish Messiah, Forever!

    “Did ‘Yoshke’ fulfill the “first time” any of the things that the Messiah is meant to fulfill according to the Torah and the Prophets…case closed!!!!!”

    Yup. Messiah Yeshua fulfilled ALL the spring Feast-associated prophecies, in fact, to the point that denying His Messiahship is usually the result of refusing to the look at the facts. Those remaining are those affiliated with the fall Feasts, and what they symbolically represent. The Feast of Trumpets is next up.

  42. Mary says:

    Where do you guys get the name “yeshua”? No such name appears in the Christian books. You just make that up since you try to be Jewish when you really aren’t.
    I wonder why it was seen fit to write it in Greek and yet these messianics always try to use Hebrew. Odd isn’t it?
    They are so desperately trying to make this a Jewish religion when it is not.
    A trinity of gods is anything but Jewish. It is, however, very Greek, very Roman, very idolatrous.
    3, 3, 3gods in one! Like the gum commercial.

    And I note the self righteous I am better than you and certainly holier than thou attitude in the “to the point that denying His Messiahship is usually the result of refusing to the look at the facts. ”
    Awful self righteous attitude. I am sure that makes a lot of points with people.
    All in all a nasty piece of work.
    If you are interested in promoting your 3 in one gods, you might try being a little more civil to others.

  43. samuraimohel says:

    No, by Yoshke we mean Yoshke HaMeshugene,

    Don’t be idolaters. Fail.

    Abstain from torn flesh? That’s a prerequisite for being human, not Jewish.

    Establish courts of righteous justice? Debatable.

    No don’t convert. We have enough crazies of our own.

    Denying a dead Jewish man is the messiah is a matter of reading the bible and not engaging in delusional thinking.

  44. Margo Sidell says:

    Someone claiming to be Margo Sidell has left a comment on this site (Comment by Margo Sidell on March 28, 2008 04:04 ) that I would like removed please. Thank you, Margo Sidell

  45. samuraimohel says:

    I don’t understand, are you the only Margo Sidell on the planet? Do you have exclusive rights to that name. Since I assume you have exclusive title to the name and no one else may use that name, I’ve changed her name to Mango Slidell. When she comes to complain, I’ll change your name to something silly too.

  46. Marg0 SideII says:

    Thanks for helping me out. Could you please either change the name or remove my name from these posts? Again thank you for taking the time to do this.

  47. Let me define my terms at the outset.

    Messianic Jew = any Jew who believes he (or she) knows who the Messiah is and wishes to follow his teachings.

    Now those who believe Jesus to be Messiah who are ethnically Jewish are considered as non-Jews by mainstream observant Judaism.

    however, there is a major problem.

    Going back two millenia, many Jews then believed Bar-Kokhba to be the Messiah including Rabbi Akiva.

    Recently(ish) many followers of the Rebbe believed he was the Messiah.

    Using the same logic, you would have to admit that people who belong in the latter two categories are also no longer Jews, however, very few observant Jews wouold do such a thing.

    Personally, I think it is a seriousdouble standard.

    That said though, the Christian faith does not help itself in its continued assertions that Jesus overturned the Torah, which is actually not provable from the pages of the New Testament.

    Steve

  48. samuraimohel says:

    Your terms are wrong from the start.

    Messianic Jew = Christian of the Baptist, Pentecostal or random cult flavor who is either into exploring Christian roots or working as a missionary. Sometimes he’s got a Jewish ancestor. Mostly not even that.

    There is no major problem or double standard.

    Jews don’t believe that the messiah is a god. Anyone who is divinely anointed on a mission is a messiah. It’s one thing to make a mistake and believe that Bar Kochba’s rebellion had divine backing. Another to worship a man as a god.

  49. cyberlizard says:

    wow.. I am a Gentile. Never refer to myself as a Messianic Jew. Never have, never will. What’s more, I have never heard anyone else do it either.

    Can you brings any facts to the table, or just your own opinion.

    As for seeing the Messiah as a God, the Targumic tradition and certain elements within early Jewish literature certainly appear to connect the Spirit of HaShem with the Spirit of Messiah. They also commonly used circumlocutions such as the Word of HasShem where Word would be debar / mamre and this appears to be carried over heavenly into the gospel supposedly written by someone called John.

    maybe you need to see Christianity through the eyes of how it was at the outset rather than what it became!

  50. samuraimohel says:

    Really?

    This comments section is chock full of examples of it. Christians using Jewish names, rabbinical titles and pretending to be something they’re not.

    How hard is this to understand. There are two religions here. Judaism and Christianity. You’re members of the one that believes in Christ. We’re not.

    Our religion sees messiahs as human beings chosen by G-d. Yours sees the founder of your religion as a god. Trying to blur that difference won’t make it go away. It won’t turn us into Christians. It won’t turn you into Jews.

    It just makes us lose respect for you when you try and pretend to be something you’re not.

  51. Mango Slidell says:

    My name is Mango Slidell and I want that fake Mango’s comments removed !!
    And YES I am the only Mango Slidell on the planet. No one else’s parents are that stupid!
    Thank you for listening. No one else does.

  52. HarryKrishna says:

    Lonely? Christian? Do Jews hate you for being a fake Jew? Then sign up today at HarryKrishna’s Kristian Dating Site and find new love in a new age.
    Don’t be stuck in a rut, don’t be lonely anymore.
    Find love with a proper messyantic Jew today.

  53. Barbara Apfelbaum says:

    I have a relative who is Jewish and went to join the messianic church around here.
    They do lie.
    They have a list of terms not to use like “baptism” and “holy spirit” and “christian”. That is deceptive to say the least.
    Its on their website.
    While some few Jews are in this they are mostly christians who are sick of their own brand of the religion and move on to this because its different for them.

  54. Parmentier Bolivar III says:

    My name is Mango Slidell and I want that fake Mango’s comments removed !!
    And YES I am the only Mango Slidell on the planet. No one else’s parents are that stupid!
    Thank you for listening. No one else does.

  55. Margo Slidell says:

    How dare you wicked fake Margos hijack my good name. I demand that you immediately remove them and then me and then everyone! Now!

  56. Boaz says:

    Love this site, it provides light of the subject of Christ people acting like Jews and their arrogant attitudes towards the unknown. They appear to be confused about the terms they use and the definitions change from argument to argument depending on the out come they seek. I have met a few messy’s in my time and don’t care to invite to my home or talk about the unseen with them. They have hold of their concepts and attempt to force them on others with out regard for the model the other people hold with high regard( rude). In the main their a idol worshiping people who use Jewish terms and symbols to enhance their low self worth.

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